Interview with Ambassador Tom Nides
Tom Nides is the United States Ambassador to Israel. He was the chief operating officer and vice chairman of Morgan Stanley.
A Reform Jew From Duluth, Minnesota
Contents
Max Raskin: What’s the least Israeli thing about you?
Tom Nides: I don't speak Hebrew very well.
I'm a liberal, reform Jew from Duluth, Minnesota. Okay? I'm a cultural Jew. I'm not a religious Jew. I just grew up caring about being a Jew for the reasons Zionism is all about. Not to get heavy here, but being a Zionist to me is caring about the creation of the State of Israel and maintaining it as a democratic, Jewish state. And that is why I'm here. And that is why I'm Jewish. And that is why I feel like I'm part of the place. Not because I'm a Hebrew scholar or religious scholar.
MR: But you always wear a suit. That’s not very Israeli.
TN: I think it's important to have symbolism that I'm the American ambassador. I'm not, unlike you, wearing sandals, looking like a hippie.
MR: They're Tevas though.
TN: My point is I think I have to — in some way — represent the United States of America. The United States is Israel's most important ally, and I happen to be fortunate enough to represent the United States of America. So I think it's important that I look the part and be respectful.
MR: How do you keep track of all the people you meet in this job? I know I asked you this when we got a drink the other night.
TN: Drinks. You had more than one drink — just for reference. I had a drink.
MR: You must get a million business cards as a diplomat.
TN: My philosophy on friendships and relationships is you don't have to have a billion of them. You have to have enough of them and get close. So I try not to collect friends. I try to collect solid relationships. When I leave here, if I have 25 people that I’ll actually call again, that's what I'm trying to achieve. I meet hundreds of people a week and they are fine, and we take a selfie and it's all perfectly beautiful — but they don't really care. What I want to do is have a relationship with a handful of people here that represent all the different parts of Israel.
MR: How do you stay in touch with people? Calls? Text?
TN: All the above. I try to call people constantly because I think texting is a convenient, but uncomfortable and sort of pathetic way to communicate. I just want to hear people's voices, not some stupid emoji. I want to have a real relationship.
The good news in this job — because of the time difference — I can be calling my kids and my friends back in the States at night before I go to bed. So I'm constantly going through my WhatsApp and seeing the people that I haven't talked to in the last few days. And I may shoot them a text asking them to get dinner. Again, the friends I have, I want to have those relationships. I want to go deep. I'm not interested in going shallow.
Ambassador Kardashian
MR: You mentioned WhatsApp. Did you have WhatsApp before you came here?
TN: No.
MR: So WhatsApp is a totally new thing to you?
TN: Yeah. I mean, it's not a big deal. It's like any other texting app. Quite frankly, I use Signal now more than WhatsApp.
MR: In the morning, where do you get your news from?
TN: I start my morning very early — I go to the Y every morning at 6:15.
MR: The Y right across from the King David?
TN: Yes. Because Christians and Jews and Muslims and everything in between go there. It's a melting pot.
MR: What do you do for exercise?
TN: I normally go and do the elliptical or the bike or run for half an hour, then do weights.
But I start my morning with CNN because I want to see what my wife’s up to. Then you’ll appreciate that I’ll read the Wall Street Journal. By the way, the problem is I don't physically have newspapers anymore, which drives me absolutely bonkers. Because I miss stuff all the time.
I go from the Wall Street Journal to the New York Times. And then I go from the New York Times to the Washington Post and from the Washington Post, I go to Politico. And then if I have time maybe I now go to Puck.
MR: Do you read Playbook?
TN: I’ll read it every afternoon because it's a little gossipy and most of the people I know pretty well.
MR: What about Twitter? Are you on Twitter?
TN: Not really. I have a big Twitter following. You should just know I'm huge on Twitter. I'm like a Kardashian. I never was on Twitter in my life before I got here. Now I'm like, "What do I do today on Twitter?"
I do a Shabbat Shalom video every Friday.
I compete with Rahm Emanuel in Japan to see who has a better Twitter following. I'm much more successful. And I remind him that Japan has 130 million people. We have 9 million and I have 140,000 followers and he's got like 70.
MR: You have a little bit of an advantage because a higher percentage here speak English than in Japan.
TN: Oh yeah, good point. But he does his in Japanese too.
MR: He speaks Japanese?
TN: No, he doesn't. He doesn't speak English very well either.
MR: You heard Obama’s joke about his middle finger? You know — how it was cut off, rendering him virtually mute.
TN: He has a whole story that he was in Israel and he was serving in the volunteer military — it was cut off in Arby's or something. It was ridiculous.
MR: Where did you take your kids when they visited?
TN: First I took them to a lot of good restaurants, both in Jerusalem and Tel Aviv.
MR: What's your favorite restaurants in Jerusalem and Tel Aviv?
TN: My favorite restaurant here is Crave, which is a kosher burger joint. And at Machneyuda — the burgers are fantastic, the fries are excellent. Fantastic. In Tel Aviv, there's a restaurant called Kalamata right in Jaffa on the water.
MR: Where are your favorite french fries in the United States?
TN: Five Guys.
MR: What else do you do when they visit?
TN: We go to the Kotel [Western Wall]. We go to the museums. I brought them to Yad Vashem this time. Then we went down south and did Masada and the Dead Sea. I went up north and went to Acre and went up to the Golan Heights.
MR: Is there anything that you have discovered as Ambassador that's a little secret?
TN: As ambassador, I can do the Church of the Holy Sepulcher in like 12 minutes. The guy who meets me there is one of the guys who holds a key that has been in this family for 600 years. He pulls out this big wooden key.
Fritz Mondale
MR: Do you go to any of the beaches?
TN: I run at the beach every weekend in Tel Aviv.
MR: Really?
TN: Not without my shirt on, I don't want to scare any people.
MR: How long do you run?
TN: 45 minutes.
MR: And do you listen to music?
TN: I listen to books.
MR: What are you listening to now?
TN: I just finished David Friedman’s book. I did Martin Indyk's book. I read James Patterson's books. I actually run faster when I read novels, but I try to do biographies. I don't do music.
MR: You didn’t work for McGovern, you worked for…
TN: …Mondale.
MR: Mondale.
TN: Not that old.
MR: You wrote Mondale as a young kid, right?
TN: No, I was in high school — I was a high school senior. I wasn’t the valedictorian…I was close but I wasn’t there.
MR: Who was the valedictorian?
TN: I have no idea. Some loser who wasn't very fun.
MR: Were you fun in high school?
TN: Of course.
MR: Did you play sports in high school?
TN: Tennis, running. I was a decent athlete. A Maccabee.
MR: Did you participate ever in the Maccabi Games?
TN: No, but I went to them this time though. I went to throw out the first pitch. Did you see me at the game throwing out the first pitch?
MR: No. How did you do?
TN: Threw right across the plate.
MR: Really?
TN: Huge. And then someone told me my shirt was too small and my shirt came up and they saw my belly when I was throwing.
Anyway, so I sent Mondale’s chief of staff a note. He was from Duluth — his parents owned the dry cleaner in Duluth — and I kept writing him every couple days, and then calling him at 4:30 in the morning because he woke up really early. Finally, he agreed to get Mondale to come to Duluth, to my high school graduation, which Vice Presidents normally don't do. And we became so close in those one and a half minutes in which I met him.
I felt it was really important now that I knew him so well in those 90 seconds, I needed to be an intern for him when he was still Vice President in 1980. And so I then went to Washington as an intern and my seatmate in my little office was Amy Klobuchar, who did okay with her career.
And then I worked for Mondale on his presidential campaign where he lost 49 states. And I was unemployed again.
MR: Do you write your own speeches?
TN: No, I pick up a phone and call a speechwriter and ask them to write something for me. But then I take what they write and then I rewrite it into my own voice.
I do not really like giving speeches. I like giving talks. I like being interviewed.
You have to be a better performer to give a really good speech. And you have to spend the time on it. I met a guy who I worked with on Wall Street who used to spend hours preparing for his speeches.
I don't have the discipline to spend the time. I could use a teleprompter, but not as well as other people can. So I don't really like using it. I gave a speech at our big 4th of July celebration. I was falling asleep during my speech. I was listening to myself drone on and I'm thinking, “This is really boring.”
MR: Did you ever work with a public speaking coach or one of those speechwriting consultants?
TN: Yeah — Michael Sheehan who everyone uses.
Ambassador School Rules
MR: Did you go to the State Department’s ambassador school?
TN: I did go to Ambassador School.
MR: What's that like?
TN: You know, it's funny because it depends on who's in your class. I had a very funny class. I had Rahm Emanuel, who is ridiculous. And he and I sat next to each other — we were horribly bad kids in class.
My next seatmate was Cindy McCain, who is a wonderful human being. And we had Senator Flake from Arizona. The problem with Flake…he's so good looking…every time he came next to me, I moved him away from me. He's out of central casting.
MR: Did you talk during class?
TN: Of course.
MR: Did you take any notes?
TN: No.
MR: Were people there taking notes?
TN: Copious notes.
MR: And you didn't take any notes?
TN: I didn’t take any notes. I doodled.
Making Reservations for Dinner
MR: What kind of pen do you use?
TN: I don't like BIC pens. I like roller pens. [Takes out pen].
MR: Oh, you use the Uni-Ball?
MR: Where do you get your suits?
TN: I get them in Washington, D.C. at Saks Fifth Avenue.
MR: What about your ties?
TN: Hermes.
MR: Where do you get your glasses?
TN: At Georgetown Optician in D.C.
MR: How bad is your vision?
TN: Terrible. I think with them on, they can't even get to 20/20 with them on. I have a terrible astigmatism. What are you, an ophthalmologist?
MR: Where do you get your shoes from?
TN: These are actually Tod's out of New York.
MR: When you go back to D.C., is there a food you miss you go first to eat?
TN: My wife's cooking.
My wife doesn't cook. I say the old joke — she makes reservations. I like Bourbon Steak, which is right down the street from our house. I like Cafe Milano because it's a fun place to go.
MR: Would you go there in the Trump years when it was a scene?
TN: Sure. I don't care about this stuff. I'm not that ideological. I'm a liberal, Democratic guy, which is fine, but I don't dislike right wing people for the sake of just being right wing. If they have a point of view, that’s great. It's entertaining for me.
*Top Secret Middle East Peace Plan*
MR: If you were doing your career over, would you go into finance?
TN: Absolutely.
MR: What do you like about finance?
TN: I like the deals. I like interesting people. I like the international piece of it. I think it's enjoyable. I like business. I like making money. I don't have a problem with that.
MR: You’re very frank. I think this might be unusual in both business and diplomacy. Am I allowed to say that you curse?
TN: Sure.
MR: Are you worried about that?
TN: Here's the deal. In life, you have to be authentic. I'm respectful. You can be authentic, but you have to control yourself in certain environments, and I'm very respectful with whoever I'm with. But I don't try to be something I'm not. I'm not a career diplomat who never swears, or never has opinions that are outside the norm. That's who I am. I want to be real, but respectful.
Tonight, I'm going to have dinner with the rabbi of the Western Wall. I'm going to be respectful to him and his beliefs and what he cares about. Then I'm seeing a bunch of members of Congress this afternoon.
But you have to be real. I'm not doing this job to be some sort of fake.
MR: Is it fun?
TN: It's great. It’s a huge honor. Being the American Ambassador to Israel. How cool is that?
MR: Do you have any news you want to break with me? Any deep scoops about a secret Middle East peace plan or anything like that?
TN: I would have to kill you if I told you.