Interview with Congressman Ron Paul
Ron Paul is a physician and former congressman who represented Texas in the United States House of Representatives. He ran for president as a Libertarian in 1988 and as a Republican in 2008 and 2012.
The Free Man
Contents
Max Raskin: What newspapers, blogs, or websites do you read every day?
Ron Paul: I try to read and look at as many different ones as possible. When I'm looking for more precise information, I use ZeroHedge. Lew Rockwell, I use a lot, and anything that's libertarian-leaning I will be looking at.
But also, I like to get up slowly and get ready for my own program. I want to know what's going on in the financial markets, so I spend a lot of time there. I also want to know what the major networks are doing – that’s just to keep me informed on how they're spinning things because I'm trying to stay up to date for my Liberty Report.
MR: Do you still read physical newspapers?
RP: Well, I miss them. I can remember times going back and forth from Washington when things were a little bit more normal. The lounges would stack a lot of papers and they were usually courtesy – they might have six or eight newspapers there, including foreign papers. I usually took one of each – whether it was Barron's, the Wall Street Journal, or Washington Post. I had a subconscious thought, “I have to find at least one bit of information in each paper so that I come back with a little more knowledge.” Usually that would take care of my two-and-a-half-hour trip. I was raised looking at newspapers. If there's a newspaper and I happen to see one, I take it just for old time's sake.
And if I was impressed with something, I might take notes and write a little bit. I wouldn't write a major article, but I'd write a lot of notes to myself under those circumstances, which I do now if I'm looking at my various sites on my computer. I still like to read hard copies. I do a lot of printing – probably more than the average person that uses the computer.
MR: You've known all the big names in the libertarian and Austrian schools. Is there a libertarian periodical that you miss or loved the most?
RP: I probably don't have one that stands out because I always figured I'd get some good out of all of them, but The Freeman was certainly helpful. And anything Leonard Read did, I was interested in because he had a lot of influence on me. Not only on the philosophy, but his gentleness, his approach, and his demeanor on how to spread the message. I would never miss reading any of his articles and his pamphlets that he put out.
But other than that, there isn't one that I would say was so much better than the next 10. I always looked for some good out of every one of them. Sometimes, even back when we were reading newspapers, you still couldn't get enough. In a way, the Internet has helped a lot.
At the same time though, we have to be very, very cautious about how the Internet is used because it's not always our friend. I’m concerned about that, but I still find the Internet tremendously helpful for us to get encyclopedic-type information, because I imagine most of that turns out pretty accurate. But when it gets into politics and social orders and all this stuff, boy, you better be careful.
The Father, Son, and Murray Rothbard
MR: You mentioned Leonard Read – was there anyone you just loved talking to the most? Murray Rothbard? Mises?
RP: Well, obviously Murray because I knew him so well and he worked with the Mises Institute, and I helped get that started. The conferences with Murray there always were very entertaining and very educational. But there was somebody else who got his PhD under Mises who was not as well-known because he doesn't have a gigantic textbook – that's Hans Sennholz who was a teacher at Grove City College. I got to know him real well. Matter of fact, he attended the very first conference that was held, the Gold Conference in New Orleans, [Jim] Blanchard's conference, when Blanchard was promoting legalization of gold. That's where I met Sennholz and got to enjoy visiting with him whenever I could.
MR: Peter Boettke and Joe Salerno were both influenced by him, right?
RP: Salerno, I know for sure. I don't know Boettke.
Sennholz had a lot of students because he taught at Grove City. Many of them ended up in Washington as interns for me or worked in my congressional office. Matter of fact, I think there's some still down there working with Thomas Massie.
Ayn Rand Paul
MR: Would you ever share papers or articles with Rand? What would you say your influence on your son was?
RP: Well, more osmosis than anything else. He was independent, he has self-initiative, and by the time he was really into it, for a good many years, especially when he was growing up, my main time was spent in medicine.
When I ran for Congress or the presidency, and he ran, a lot of interviewers naturally thought that we would communicate a lot and discuss things and talk about strategy and all that. And that really wasn't it.
Rand was always most interested in strategy and organization. I had a real tough race when I decided to go back into Congress in 1996, and the Republicans hated my guts. They were doing everything conceivable, so we had to work real, real hard. I think he took a year off from his school and came down and was the organizer. He went to the courthouse and studied the list. I never enjoyed that part. I wanted to talk about the issues and the Federal Reserve. Even now, he'll come here for Christmas, but it's almost like we don't need to talk about it. He's more interested in playing golf with his brothers.
Ideas Matter
MR: How do you stay in touch with your friends? Do you like to text?
RP: Any way I can. I still like telephones. There’re a few people who have been strong supporters and good friends of mine, and just because of their health, I don't talk to them too much and they might not do a lot of email. So, I'll call them – I'd rather have conversations.
When the computers first came in in the 90s, I walked into one of my rooms at the congressional offices with six people jammed in a room, defying the image that we all had of these fancy suites. One person was at one desk talking and there was a conversation going on. The individual I was talking to said, "Oh, let me check with so and so." And so she emailed the person that was sitting next to her. And I thought, "Why don't you just ask him!?”
I think – and I have been proven correct on this – a lot of people have gotten in a lot of trouble with tweeting and email.
RP: I remember there was a court case Bill Gates lost because they read his emails. I thought, “He invented this stuff, and yet it was enough to lose a civil case because of it.” I think there's something depersonalized with that, and yet I use it all the time, but I want it to be used for precise purposes.
MR: You’re a little bit like Bernie Sanders in that whenever interviewers ask Sanders about his favorite ice cream or his favorite music, he always brings it back to his ideas. You always bring things back to the ideas. Do you do that in your personal life as well? Do you love talking about these ideas with your friends and with your wife?
RP: I guess. I became fascinated with it: The issue for me is promoting liberty and that's what we all should be doing. If we have our liberties, the option is up to us to be successful. We can pursue excellence and virtue on our own and get it out of the hands of the government. And so I spend all my time thinking about it.
Why I Am Not a Conservative
MR: I’ve noticed a lot of former supporters of yours are calling themselves conservatives now. What do you think about that?
RP: You mean people calling themselves conservatives now rather than libertarian?
MR: Yes.
RP: I don't use the word “conservative” very often – maybe just in a social sense. People make up their own minds and they're responsible for all their own actions, but I live a personal lifestyle I would call more conservative.
But I don't think of myself as a political conservative at all. I think too much harm has been done in the name of conservatism. Right now, especially when you use a hyphen, neo-conservatives, that really bugs me because the neo-conservative is an anti-libertarian and they're the ones that identify with a foreign policy that I have strong resistance to.
MR: What do you think about this new national conservative movement that's much more non-interventionist? Basically Pat Buchanan types.
RP: I wouldn't use “national conservative” because it strikes on maybe an opening for a more aggressive foreign policy. But Pat, I know very well. I work with him and there are things that we would disagree with, but I still think he's very libertarian now. He came out against the wars that I came out against. I think it’s good that he’s there because answering the neo-conservatives is very important.
Pot-smoking Bitcoin Bug?
MR: I need to ask you about bitcoin because in some ways, you're the political founding father of cryptocurrency. How do you feel about so many people who are into bitcoin admiring you?
RP: Well, that's their business. Somebody would say to me, “Oh, Ron Paul, we love you. You're a doctor and you champion the freedom to use marijuana and you're pro-marijuana.” And I say, “No, I'm not. I'm not pro-marijuana, I'm pro-freedom.” You make your own choices and assume the responsibility.
I think my position on bitcoin is somewhat similar to that. The bitcoin people do like me. I still go to their conferences, mainly because I think the world's a disaster, the financial system is coming apart, and the government money is terrible, and people ought to have a right to be able to develop something.
I don't have a final answer on bitcoin. All I know is it ought to be legal and you can't commit fraud. But I would never say bitcoin will replace the dollar and it’s going to be the money of the world and you can't do anything about it because the momentum is so strong. I don't think anybody knows the answer to that.
This might be making your point that I always drift back to principles – the principle is that people ought to be able to use it. Under dire conditions like war time, people use all kinds of things when the currencies just dry up.
MR: Like cigarettes.
RP: Cigarettes became very good money. Even today there's a bit of that that goes on. The more authoritarian the system is, the more it's likely. I'm interested in protecting the freedom of choice on it.
The Golden Rule
MR: The personal choice you make is with gold. You still like gold, right?
RP: I do, but only because history tells me. I like to read the history of gold and it goes back to 5,000 years B.C. It's been around a long, long time.
MR: Do you read the Bible every day?
RP: No, but I look it up when I want something specifically. I remember when I did my little booklet on gold and money, I could find plenty of things in the Bible that would be of interest to me. I did read the Bible in the past straight through, but I don't do that every day.
MR: Do you think if you were 25 right now you would go into medicine? Do you think you would go into politics? Finance?
RP: So far, I've never “gone into” something. I did make a practical decision when I was in college, late in my college career. I was a science major in biology and thought science was interesting. But it wasn't like I was raised knowing I was going to be a doctor. It was a pragmatic thing. I liked medicine, I liked the idea of helping people, and I liked the science of it. And I knew that if I didn't get into medicine, I could do other things with biology. So it's not something I had a such a plan for.
People say, “Well, when did you decide you wanted to go into politics?” Never.
If you ask me today, “Well, Ron, what do you think? Do you think I should drop what I'm doing now and run for Congress?” I don't know your situation, but I would say, “No, don't do that.” A lot of young people come up after I give talks, they'll say they want to run for Congress. Don’t do it!
Dr. No
MR: What was your least favorite part about being a congressman?
RP: Probably the airplane, flying back and forth.
But it was something I accepted while I was doing it. Matter of fact, when I ran, I had no idea I'd win. I told my wife I should run. She says, “That's so dangerous because you're liable to win.” And I said, “No, I could guarantee you that wouldn't happen,” because I wasn't going to make all those promises. I said I would not win with the philosophy I had.
And then I wanted to prove that they’d kick me out if I kept talking about this and voting exactly that way. So I set out the goal to do exactly what I said and I just knew voting all by myself was not politically smart.
MR: They’d vote to give those gold coins to people like Mother Teresa and you’d be the only one voting against it. Was there ever a vote that you wanted to just say, “You know what, no principles for this one time, I'll throw the principles aside.”
RP: No, those votes were easy for me because they offered an opportunity for me to explain them. One time, there was something for Cardinal O'Connor, a gold medal for him, and I was the only one voting against it.
By the time I got back to my office, the press secretary said, “Oh boy, you're getting calls, the New York Times wants to talk to you. Why are you voting against O'Connor? Why aren't you giving him gold coin? And Mother Theresa too, you're not getting them gold coins.” They wanted to know if I was anti-Catholic!
But the staff told me, and I said I vote against all gold medals on principle. I advocate that if congressmen want to award a gold medal, they should all donate their own money and buy the medal themselves.
MR: Was there ever any vote that you really found difficult in your tenure?
RP: There was one and it had to do with war. Most of my experience and work was anti-war and against voting for the authority for war in the Middle East. But the very first thing after 9/11 was a vote to give the president the authority to go after people who committed 9/11. Since I'm not an anarchist, I thought, “Well, this is terrible and it's difficult because he doesn't even know who did it.” But it turned out that technically, the language was okay: Go after the bad guys that just bombed our country and killed 3,000 people.
But the real message there was, “Don't do it because they’re a bunch of scoundrels, and they'll take advantage of it, and they’re liable to start a bigger war.” And that's exactly what they did.
It's one of those things: Do you vote against something because you know they're going to abuse it, or do you vote for it because you think it is justified? I thought it was justified, by very little. Everything was so clear cut, especially going into Afghanistan. That was when several other Democrats and Walter Jones helped me on that.
MR: I remember that.
RP: Oh, you do?
MR: In high school I wrote about your vote against giving the gold coin to Mother Teresa.
RP: Wow.
Lone Star Heimish
MR: Do you still bike ride? Do you still like to exercise?
RP: Yes, I do, very much so. I've had a couple problems with my knees which has slowed me up on my bicycle. I ride less, but I still ride. I walk more. That’s the first thing I do – I wake up early and spend two or three hours doing the thing that I want to do, which includes catching up on the news but also a couple miles walk. If the conditions are right, I could ride a bike in the afternoon.
MR: What kind of bike do you have?
RP: It's nothing special, I don't even know which. It's one of these…what do they call them? It's not a speed bike and it's not a mountain bike.
MR: A road bike?
RP: Well, I don't know whether call it a road bike or not, but it's pretty plain.
MR: There's a Yiddish word, heimish – it means unpretentious and homey. And you’re probably the most heimish politician out there. But I have to ask you this: Is there anything you like to splurge on? Any extravagance?
RP: Well, I can tell you one thing I can exclude is a fancy car. That never made any sense to me. People spend a lot of money on cars, but that didn't make sense. Those are the things I would exclude.
I would think that the thing that I'm most conscientious about would be my family – doing things with the family.
We bought property when I first started medicine in 1968, but we never built on it. It was a little farm – 40 acres or so – but it just sat there all this time. So when I got out of Congress, my wife and I decided, “Why don’t we build a house?”
So we built a house which has a big swimming pool, you can play volleyball. My wife has a sewing room, I have a big office where I have all my books. And she wanted to do a dining area and living room and kitchen which are very, very big. So for Christmas, we will have more than 50 people from our immediate family and we will all sit in the same room, and that pleases me and it pleases my wife and the kids all like it.